Pharm Tech Minutes 2012.10.24

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09:00 - 09:30 Welcome

  • Welcome
  • Call to Order/Roll Call
  • IHE
  • Juergen Brandstaetter
  • Jacqueline Surugue
  • Michael Tan
  • Marc Robberecht
  • Eric Poiseau
  • Leonidas Tzimis
  • Simon Letellier
  • Jose Costa Teixeira
  • Stephen Chu
  • HL7
  • Tom de Jong
  • Melva Peters
  • Jean Duteau
  • Nicolas Canu
  • Hugh Glover
  • Julie James
  • Review and Approve Agenda
  • Approved


09:30 - 10:00 Wrap-up last year

  • Progress since the last meeting and forward plans on each side
  • HL7
  • Prepared topics in HL7 Pharmacy for ballot (extensive process)
  • Some already normative, others still in progress
  • HL7 V3 Pharmacy material formerly intended to be used in Community Pharmacy, but now also prepared for Institutional Pharmacy (= Hospital Pharmacy). This work is almost finished.
  • Work on Medication profile work-item
  • Proposals for future work/collaboration
  • Work on storyboards could be shared or beind done collaborated, because they are usually the same
  • How do we make sure that people adopt the standards of HL7 and IHE since that pair results in the "way to use all the material in the right way"?
  • Todo: Jürgen will provide a slide with the statement, will be shaped between the co-chairs until suitable


  • IHE
  • Maintenance of profiles
  • No big changes, exceptional cases added
  • Doing marketing for Deployment
  • Collaborative work with PCD according "Administration devices"
  • Work on Medication Documentation
  • IHE International strategic change



10:00 - 12:15 Strategie for increasing adoption and deployment of both IHE and HL7

  • Tom presents the layers of interoperability
  • TRANSPORT
  • XDS, AORTA, ...
  • PACKAGING
  • Messages, CDA
  • CONTENT
  • Data model, Terminology
  • CONCEPTS (hard to standardize by HL7 or IHE)
  • Semantics, Glossary


  • Discussion about enhancing the flexibilty of IHE profiles in order to also fit to "message-based" archtictures, e.g. Cananda
  • We realized that also the Canada topology contains also a central repository and therefore it's not that much different to the CMPD model, except that CMPD relies on XDS only at the moment
  • In order to do that there are the following Todos:
  • New IHE work-item: Will check the separation of CMPD actors into "Content Creator" and "Transport" actors and evaluates if the grouping with XDR/XDM would also be possible
  • Jürgen
  • New Joint work-item: "Standardized content": Agree on a common data model for e.g. Prescription and subsequently decide if to change/enhance PRE profile or create an alternative second content profile (similar for other content types)
  • Jürgen, Tom
  • Evaluate the creation of a CMPD.b profile which shall be consider topologies without central repository (e.g. US approach of sending the prescription directly to the Pharmacy)
  • We agree that this is main difference in topology (central registry existing or not)
  • Considered as important but second priority. Postponed until first item is completed


12:15 - 13:00 --- Lunch ---

13:00 - 14:30 Medication Profile (with break)

  • Yesterday's outcome
  • Proposal for continuing tomorrow:
  • 1) Approve the hierarchy of Stephen's slides
  • 2) Discuss and approve each definition within the hierarchy
  • 3) Define next steps


  • Review of Stephen's presentation
  • Decisions
  • Terms have to harmonized in a glossary in context of their usage
  • Glossary will be done during shaping the definitions
  • Use-cases shall be created and shall come from a wide community
  • Parallel to the work on the hierarchy/definitions a second work-item will be worked our bottom-up and which describes data-sources and the according nature of the data as well as related aspects necessary to provide the data needed by the other work-item
  • The term "reconsiliation" has two meanings:
  • 1) Matching data with reality (e.g. by asking the patient)
  • 2) Finding the right future medication by considering the past medication and clinical situation of the patient
  • Agreed term for (1): Medication Reconsiliation
  • Agreed term for (2): Medication Revision


  • Todo
  • Stephen will consolidate the slide deck and combines the terms in the hierarchy with the definitions formerly sent. Will send to both groups when done (within 2 weeks)
  • Jacqueline, Stephen, Melva, Leonidas will provide use-cases, Michael reviews
  • Jose takes the lead of the second work-item. Approved that work on this work-item may start immediately.


  • Next steps
  • Wait for Stephen's slides
  • Jacqueline on behalf of all use-case makers will communicate the decision if a TCon is needed before use-cases will be created (within 2 weeks after slides received)


15:00 - 15:15 --- Break ---

15:15 - 16:00 Pharmacy CDA Mapping Project

  • Introduction of project
  • Primary goal: Mapping of HL7 Pharmacy Message Types information elements to suitable CDA R2 information elements
  • Second goal: Stylesheet for automatic generation


  • Interest in following or participating?
  • Collaborative work implicitly given by work-item "Standardized content" and following work-items
  • Extend CDA Schema (for IHE Pharmacy) will be provided to Tom and Michael
  • Michael will check if NICTIZ could provided resources for doing the mapping
  • Suggested tool for mapping: Altova MapForce (or similars)


16:00 - 16:15 Review of recent change in Pharmacy CMET in 2011

  • See CP-PHARM-035
  • Are there any more changes to expect in the near future?
  • Yes, it's because Substances became a section of the Common Product Model
  • Recommendation of HL7 Pharmacy: Wait at least to Common Product Model Release 12 (currently Rel 10)
  • Release Number does not correspond to Normative Edition numbering!


16:15 - 16:30 Glossary work item

  • Status
  • Marco and Derrek Evans have worked on it
  • No information about the current status
  • Expected end of the work-item can not be estimated because work on it is on hold at the moment


  • Yesterday's outcome
  • Sync with ISO Glossary (SKMT) necessary?
  • Discussion
  • Melva: It's not clear, if this is globally well accepted. It's more a "gathering" tool which allows multiple definitions for terms without governance
  • Nicolas: SKMT names itself "Glossary" but its rather a dictionary. A glossary should always be seen in some context


  • Decision
  • Should definately be used as a source for our common glossary
  • Contributing our terms to SKMT once we decided on our preferred definitions


16:30 - 17:00 Any other business

  • ISO plans a new work item "Drug dictionary" - what is our standpoint?
  • Julie reports
  • A small group will prepare a proposal for the "Requirements of a drug dictionary"
  • Not clear if an international or national drug dictionary?
  • Discussion
  • Hugh: It's inapproriate to begin such a piece of work when the IDMP standard (referred by the new item) is not yet finalized.
  • Jacqueline: The requirements differ a lot even within countries.
  • Decision
  • Wait for the actual proposal


  • Frank Gener sends PHAST document: "The Functional Interoperability Framework for Automated Systems Integration in Electronic Medication Management Processes"
  • IHE identifies this document to be related to HMW and Supply Chain
  • Mostly already covered by the Supply Chain Whitepaper, because of synchronized work in the past
  • Document will be put to FTP in subfolder "Resources" to folder "Supply Chain" whitepaper
  • HL7
  • Document will be published internally
  • Will be evaluated in the future


Next meetings

  • IHE
  • F2F meeting in March 18-19, 2013 at Arsenal-IT, Treviso, Italy
  • IHE offer to HL7:
  • Join our meeting on the 19th and HL7 adds 2 days for you own
  • Is expected not to be problem for Arsenal-IT
  • Todo Jürgen: Will contact Claudio if it's possible and inform HL7 co-chair
  • F2F meeting in June 11-12, 2013 at Nictiz, Den Haag, Netherlands
  • IHE offer to HL7:
  • Join our meeting on the 12th and HL7 adds 2 days for you own
  • Nictiz confirms this possibility
  • No F2F meetings are defined for season yet
  • IHE would be willing to plan March's and October's meeting together with HL7 in order to do a joint day on both
  • IHE also has access to quite some locations (sponsored) which could also be extended to HL7 group
  • HL7
  • No future out-of-cycle meetings planned
  • March could be possible
  • Decision most likely not before Jan 2013
  • Regulary meetings:
  • Jan 13-18, 2013, Phoenix
  • May 5-10, 2013, Atlanta
  • Sep 22-27, 2013, Camebridge/Massachussets